Bacteria - Ipaq 3600 PDA resurrected, improved! *DONE*

Post by **CronoTriggerfan** » Thu Nov 08, 2007 5:24 pm

Seriously man, you never cease to amaze. This is getting sexier by the minute, literally!

CTFan

bacteria · Post by **bacteria** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 4:58 pm

I rigged up a set of 4 x AA batteries by securing wires to bolts and hot gluing them in place, I then sealed them with masking tape so they can't make a short elsewhere.

They are inside the system now and work fine. I achieved what I had planned.

I have a big problem - the system has been turned on and off so many times that I think the system has become corrupted - either that or the system doesn't like 5.7v from freshly recharged batteries and I blew something (quite possible). I managed to get it once this morning to complete the initial configuration screens and all the buttons worked nicely, although that was only once - most of the time it just hangs or keeps wanting the initiation screen to be redone many times. All I can do is undo the wiring and get it back to the way it started, if as I think, this will make no difference, then it looks like the project will have died at the last hurdle. I am just hoping that there is an issue with one of the wires and I can find it - however I am not too hopeful; I think the wiring is quite sound. It is probably fried.

I won't have much project time (if any) until Monday morning. I will do my final tests then - if it is fried, it is fried (can't win 'em all - onto next project); however if I can solve the issue then I will have the project completed before the end of the week for sure.

vskid · Post by **vskid** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 7:33 pm

If it is fried, I might sell you mine for the cost of shipping. It seems that NiMH batteries don't like being treated like lithiums. Might have been because of the extra load from having the light plugged in. I'm going to test it light-less, if the batteries still do crappy, you can buy it.

Post by **Skyone** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 7:34 pm

Get a regulated 5v line on there, see if that works. (It does take 5v, right?)

bacteria · Post by **bacteria** » Sat Nov 10, 2007 4:03 am

Thanks for the support, guys.

I removed most of the soldered connections, tested the system again with the batteries and then with the power supply. I still get the same result - it can take several attempts to get past the "align" screen but then hangs on the next configuration screen. I know when I was doing lots of testings a few days ago it was starting to get tempremental, but it still past the configuration screens and got into the system ok - now it doesn't.

The fact I had it all working fine properly when I gave it its long test a while back, applications worked fine (I tried several) gave me hope this project was going to succeed, but as I said before, it was becoming less happy getting turned on and off (completely) many times - probably corrupted its internal programs.

I think my system fried because:

1) 5.7v proved a killer in the end and blew something
2) as vskid suggested, there might be extra load that fried it
3) the PDA doesn't like being turned on and off many times (it is only designed to be off after manufacture, then on/standby for the rest of its life).

vskid - Ok, if you want to part with yours for the cost of shipping, that would be generous of you, please PM me if you wish to do this. It gives me the chance to then either fry that one too (if 1 or 2 above failed it), or get it working (if 3 above failed it)!!

If however you get your system working and want to keep it, but your screen dies and you need a replacement, PM me.

vskid · Post by **vskid** » Sat Nov 10, 2007 7:52 pm

Turns out my batteries were fine, I think it was just a combination of using the backlight and I don't think the batteries were being trickle charged or anything as it sat for a couple days, so they were probably partially drained anyways. It lasted between 8 and 9 hours without a backlight using 3 AA NiMH 2500mAh batteries.

I don't really have any use for the ipaq, the main reason for me doing this was to test out the concept of 3 AA/AAAs replacing of a lithium battery. So I'll be PMing you back, bacteria.

bacteria · Post by **bacteria** » Sat Nov 10, 2007 11:33 pm

vskid - Very many thanks mate, I have PM'ed you back.

Guys - project might be back on, vskid has offered me his Ipaq, which is generous of him. Hopefully I won't fry that one too!

illustriouschin · Post by **illustriouschin** » Sat Nov 10, 2007 11:44 pm

wait i thought you chose AA's instead of a li-on batterypack because there was less chance of messing it up...

bacteria · Post by **bacteria** » Sun Nov 11, 2007 7:45 am

No, NiMH AA batteries were chosen as I had them already, they are photo quality AA's so as powerful as AA's can be, and can be recharged easily and safely. Given that the original battery in the PDA was at maximum 1600mAh and the AA's are 2700 NiMH, the AA's are more than capable, as I proved, to do the job really well.

HotDog-Cart · Post by **HotDog-Cart** » Sun Nov 11, 2007 9:39 am

Hmm, This thing still works right, but it wasnt the configuration screen to be done over and over?
Doesnt sound like you blew somthing big in it. Sounds like something to do with voltage.

As, thats what my old palm iii does when its low on batteries. It keeps making me, to do the config screen. It also freezes at that screen too, as the batteries are low.

Hmm, Maybe your batteries are low on a charge? or too high? Not too sure.

bacteria · Post by **bacteria** » Sun Nov 11, 2007 12:46 pm

Hotdog-Cart - I see your logic. On reflection, there are two possible ways I might have caused the system pain - just before the booting problem started, I tried booting the system without the power cables going into the screen (but I wouldn't have thought that would damage the system directly, however it would have made all the voltage go into the mobo rather than to the screen too - might have overloaded something), or the fact that when I tested the system previously with a full set of batteries they were fine at just over 5.5v, the last time was 5.7v - perhaps this extra 0.2v did it?

What was happening was:

*Passed boot screen, v. 1.77, beep welcome sound ok
*Let you press "next" to next screen
*Went to Align stylus screen - normally only needs this once, but it kept asking several times before passing (when faulty)
*Went to "select diary option to select "cut"" (to paste on next screen) - however it didn't then respond to this and froze, or sometimes gave the option but froze. In either event, it didn't get further.

After testing the system many times on the batteries (at this point, the voltage dropped to about 5.3v) and also removed the batteries and tried the system on the official mains power; same result.

Unlike vskid, I destroyed the original connections at the rear of the PDA for the power, so needed 4 batteries; vskid only needed 3 at the back, so when I receive his item (once we make the arrangements) I will only need 3 batteries too; that will help the voltage situation, as the batteries will only get to a max of about 4.2v at peak recharge, normally more like about 3.7v.

The problem with doing a mod like this is that no-one else seems to have done one before, so I can't research what someone else did well/badly and learn from it. I have only basic electrical knowledge as such, so the chance of frying a system is far higher a probability than usual. It's more of a case of "ok, that should work" - either followed by "yippee" or "what's that smoke coming from?!".

tom61 · Post by **tom61** » Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:47 pm

bacteria wrote: What was happening was:

*Passed boot screen, v. 1.77, beep welcome sound ok
*Let you press "next" to next screen
*Went to Align stylus screen - normally only needs this once, but it kept asking several times before passing (when faulty)
*Went to "select diary option to select "cut"" (to paste on next screen) - however it didn't then respond to this and froze, or sometimes gave the option but froze. In either event, it didn't get further.

This could be caused by loose/damaged touchscreen cable. The align screen will repeat if the numbers it gets off calibration is way off, and the last 'freeze' could be caused by the movement of the screen taps moving the cable, making the connection even worse. With the wiring being brought out more than usual, since the screen is farther away now, this seems a fairly likely cause.

bacteria · Post by **bacteria** » Sun Nov 11, 2007 5:24 pm

tom61 - I think you have hit the nail on the head, because before it "went", I did find if I turned the screen a bit to the side that it was happier than if I didn't - in fact this made it work on the last successful time it got past the initial screens. I wasn't convinced the voltage was the issue, just clawing at straws. Yes, the more I think about it, the more I think you are right, thanks; the ribbon cables do move a bit and are near maximum - tomorrow or Tuesday I will check the connections and see if there is anything obvious I can resolve.

It might be, provided I haven't actually damaged the cables, that I can hot glue them to the connections so they won't move about and it might possibly work. I certainly have nothing to lose now with it; and if it still doesn't work, I will be careful with the ribbon cables with the second PDA I get! I might also remake the case to have the batteries behind the mobo instead of sandwiching.

Thanks, good advice. Even if I manage to get this one working (probably not now, damage done), I will still buy vskid's one as a spare, no problem.

bacteria · Post by **bacteria** » Mon Nov 12, 2007 4:07 am

tom61 - Turned out you were right, mate! Thanks so much!

PROJECT BACK ON!

I discovered that even if the ribbon cable is in nice and firmly, if there is more than a nominal amount of space between the screen and the mobo then you can't get past the configuration screens - even if the cable is slack. It wasn't the batteries at issue.

I have dismantled the system from the case now, and hot glued the screen to the mobo in a few discreet places, once I had checked the system works fine of course. This will stop the screen from coming detached and ensure the system continues to work fine.

I had originally tried to get four AA's between the screen and mobo for two reasons - 1) save a few millimeters in height (just a few), and 2) the D-pad I was using was in the way of the corner end of the plug-in mobo, by raising it, there was no problem.

It just means the case will be about 4mm or so taller than it was going to be.

I could re-cut the case front from scratch, but there isn't much point in this, as I decided rather than sacrifice an old GBA or G&W or old GB I have for the D-pad (as they have small D-pads), I could instead use tact switches for the D-pad - this might be better as it means the surface of the PDA will be smooth - anyway, you can use the stylus for all applications, you only really use the direction buttons for games...

I am really happy, project is back on track. Thanks once again for your advice tom61!

I have to go to bed now, got home a couple of hours ago after working night shift, I have another one tonight, then I have a fair bit of Tuesday - Friday for project work, so I should have this done by the end of the week!

HotDog-Cart · Post by **HotDog-Cart** » Mon Nov 12, 2007 5:51 am

Woo Hoo. Nice. Glad to see this back going.
The next thing I was gonna mention was the screen, as on my palm iii, theres a nice deep scratch in the screen (Goes right through the screen), that likes to make the caliberation "pause". But I've never had the caliberation freeze because of that, as I scratched it recently, and the battery issue (with the voltage), has happened for a few years.

Glad to see this project up and running.

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Bacteria - Ipaq 3600 PDA resurrected, improved! DONE