DSi- Firmware Flash?

Trying to get homebrew running on your PSP? Want to add a screen light to your Game Boy? Trying to figure out how to work your GP2X? By popular demand, discuss it in here! (This forum is for pre-built handhelds, NOT custom made portables!)

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XCVG
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DSi- Firmware Flash?

Post by XCVG » Sat Apr 11, 2009 2:28 pm

As you know, the DSi has few flashcarts, and Nintendo may lock them out in the future with firmware updates. Which brings me to my point. What if we could flash the DSi with new firmware? We wouldn't even need a flashcart! Games, homebrew, and media files could be loaded via the SD slot. Theoretically anyway. The actual hardware implementation may prevent this. In this case we would need a RAM pack like a GBA expander for regular DS. The game would be loaded into the RAM pack from the SD card and run. But it is not known if this will even be necessary (well not by me).

Of course there are disadvantages. Future games may not work with the flashed firmware. The DSi shop will obviously not work. But if it could be done, then it would be, let me find a word, AWESOME! Many things would need to be done however.
1. Find an exploit, loophole, or crack that would allow the firmware to be loaded.
2. Reverse-engineer existing firmware and create hacked version, possibly with extra functions. The simplest way would to simply implement rudimentary bootloader firmware to run interface software from the card. But someone can do better.
3. Get games and homebrew working with the hackware. It wouldn't mean a lot if all it did was boot and do nothing.
4. Try it, and work the bugs out.

I do not have the 1337 5K1LLZ necessary for this. I am merely trying to open up discusssion. This may actually be possible. Or it may be completely and utterly impossible.

One last thing. I fully condone piracy and invite you to join me as I steal games. Yes, of course I am only joking.

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nitro2k01
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Re: DSi- Firmware Flash?

Post by nitro2k01 » Sat Apr 11, 2009 2:53 pm

The DSi has two mdoes, DSi mode, and DS legacy mode. In legacy mode, all new hardware features have been disabled.(Cameras, SD slot, faster CPU speed, more RAM) In this mode, the DSi basically works like a DSLite. That's why you don't see homebrew using the new features.
To boot run code in DSi mode, (Unless/until a backdoor is found) it needs to be signed with a crypto key that only Nintendo and partners know. Same goes for firmware, if I'm correctly informed. Even if you open the DSi and reflash the chip, your custom firmware won't boot.
At this point in time nobody has managed to run unsigned code in DSi mode, at least not that has been publically disclosed.
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Re: DSi- Firmware Flash?

Post by palmertech » Sat Apr 11, 2009 3:43 pm

The DS got crazy lucky because you could exploit the download play and the openness of the GBA slot.

To be honest, from what I have heard people talking about in regard to the way firmware updates work, I think Nintendo has officially blocked the kind of "Custom Firmware" you speak of. Even with the DS Lite, you cannot make CFW, you can only use a slightly modified DS firmware. Making one that implements new feature is very, very unlikely.
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Re: DSi- Firmware Flash?

Post by XCVG » Sat Apr 11, 2009 6:59 pm

nitro2k01 wrote:To boot run code in DSi mode, (Unless/until a backdoor is found) it needs to be signed with a crypto key that only Nintendo and partners know.
A backdoor is the key to everything, isn't it? The PSP, the DS, and the XBOX among many others.
palmertech wrote:To be honest, from what I have heard people talking about in regard to the way firmware updates work, I think Nintendo has officially blocked the kind of "Custom Firmware" you speak of. Even with the DS Lite, you cannot make CFW, you can only use a slightly modified DS firmware. Making one that implements new feature is very, very unlikely.
Sony thought they blocked custom firmware too. See the above about exploits.

Okay, say we can only use a slightly modified firmware. That "slight" is the key. If someone modifies it just enough to boot unofficial code, even just one specific piece, it would be enough. Then it would be up to the software, which is significantly easier to deal with.

So the verdict is "not bloody likely". Well it's better than "hell no".

EDIT: Has anyone tried an AK2i yet? The makers claim that it can use the DSi features! A lie? Or did the crazy bastards do it?

Also, is there a board that specializes in this kind of stuff more?

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Re: DSi- Firmware Flash?

Post by megabite » Sat Apr 11, 2009 7:16 pm

Where do they claim that? Last I heard, they do not even work on American DSi units.

The GBAtemp boards would be a good place to start,
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Re: DSi- Firmware Flash?

Post by AfroLH » Sun Apr 19, 2009 6:12 pm

PSP only used exploits to downgrade. Except for 2.00 HEN which really isn't all that good.

PSP FW 1.50 originally had Homebrew support straight out of the box.

So no, Backdoors are not how everything got homebrew.

edit: and Sony knew they didn't block CFW so that is why they have so many FW updates.

In order to have CFW you have to have FW to work with, which is only possible if you can run unsigned code on the console. Which is what happened with PSP FW 1.50

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Re: DSi- Firmware Flash?

Post by Rixer 1337 » Wed May 27, 2009 8:46 pm

Sorry for the bump but I have found something relative to this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1OT4oSUKtc

This guy got homebrew running on his dsi and if you look at the link in the description they say that he might be using a save game exploit. Isn't that what the wii uses?

Also, if I get an RFi card, can I run homebrew on my dsi with it in Ds Legacy mode?
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Re: DSi- Firmware Flash?

Post by Bibin » Thu May 28, 2009 5:12 am

palmertech wrote:Even with the DS Lite, you cannot make CFW, you can only use a slightly modified DS firmware. Making one that implements new feature is very, very unlikely.
Actually, look up FWnitro.
...

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Re: DSi- Firmware Flash?

Post by Bibin » Thu May 28, 2009 5:13 am

megabite wrote:Where do they claim that? Last I heard, they do not even work on American DSi units.

The GBAtemp boards would be a good place to start,
My AceKard 2i card works in my American DSi just fine, though in regular DS mode.
...

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Re: DSi- Firmware Flash?

Post by Tester12 » Wed Jun 17, 2009 12:35 am

AfroLH wrote:PSP only used exploits to downgrade. Except for 2.00 HEN which really isn't all that good.

PSP FW 1.50 originally had Homebrew support straight out of the box.

So no, Backdoors are not how everything got homebrew.

edit: and Sony knew they didn't block CFW so that is why they have so many FW updates.

In order to have CFW you have to have FW to work with, which is only possible if you can run unsigned code on the console. Which is what happened with PSP FW 1.50
I have a PSP with Dark Alex's Custom Firmware M33, which is the official Sony firmware with all the signature requirements removed, plus a few other things added. The firmware I have has the same qualities as 1.5 and all of the added stuff all the way up. Hacking a PSP is easy, and it isn't "foolproof" yet, its more of a battle with how smart hackers are or how dumb Sony is, same goes for Nintendo. I'm sure someone will find this backdoor for the DSi just like they have with the PSP.

Edit: I have the AceKard 2i and it works fine on my DSi, just crusing around to see if anyone's created an exploit for it yet.

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Re: DSi- Firmware Flash?

Post by nitro2k01 » Sat Jul 11, 2009 7:29 am

This just in!
Team Twiizers, the same guys that hacked the Wii with a pair of tweezers, have unlocked DSi mode. Custom firmware will take some time, or possibly never happen though. (Since the firmware portion of the memory is cryptologically signed and can't be easily modified)

http://hackmii.com/2009/07/dsi-mode-homebrew-anyone/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: DSi- Firmware Flash?

Post by jleemero » Sat Jul 11, 2009 10:56 am

The Arduino made me chuckle.

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Re: DSi- Firmware Flash?

Post by nitro2k01 » Sat Jul 11, 2009 11:43 am

jleemero wrote:The Arduino made me chuckle.
It's actually only there to help them dump data from RAM, and not required for the exploit.
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Being the sadistic bastard I am, I have covered Frog's left eye with a Santa hat.

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Re: DSi- Firmware Flash?

Post by jleemero » Sat Jul 11, 2009 4:07 pm

nitro2k01 wrote:
jleemero wrote:The Arduino made me chuckle.
It's actually only there to help them dump data from RAM, and not required for the exploit.
Yes, I know.

I read the blog too ya know :wink:

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Re: DSi- Firmware Flash?

Post by arfink » Mon Jul 13, 2009 1:40 pm

Well, someone will break the cryptology. Some developer will get an unscrupulous employee and the crypto will get leaked. Count on it. It happened with CSS, it happened with Blu-Ray, it will probably happen with DSi. Or someone will stumble upon a bug in a game and get through. Or better still, no modifications to the firmware but an actual run-around hack to the hardware to disable the cryptography checks, which is more likely I think.

Oh one other thing: in order to to cryptography you have to get the key from somewhere. The DSi isn't downloading a new key every time you play it- therefore the key is stored somewhere on the thing. There has to be a way to nab it.
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